Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Nadia Naji
Jump to navigation
Jump to search
 | This discussion was subject to a deletion review on 2024 April 22. For an explanation of the process, see Wikipedia:Deletion review. |
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was no consensus. Randykitty (talk) 15:35, 22 April 2024 (UTC)
[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!
- Nadia Naji (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log | edits since nomination)
- (Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
BLP does not seem to have held any office position. Fails WP:NPOL and GNG. My WP:BEFORE search didn't bring much, which could be because of the language. Jeraxmoira🐉 (talk) 19:27, 24 March 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: People, Politicians, and Belgium. Jeraxmoira🐉 (talk) 19:27, 24 March 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Journalism-related deletion discussions. Jeraxmoira🐉 (talk) 19:28, 24 March 2024 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Women-related deletion discussions. Spiderone(Talk to Spider) 21:11, 24 March 2024 (UTC)
- Keep: joint president of a national party which has elected representatives to parliament. Could be expanded with sources from the nl:Nadia Naji, mostly 2022 sources so not associated with her current candidacy. PamD 08:41, 25 March 2024 (UTC)
- PamD: Would you mind taking a deeper look at the nl:Nadia Naji's sources again? From what I can see via google translate, they only have significant coverage surrounding her election as joint president. Apart from that, I do not see significant coverage on the other sources! Also, it would be helpful if you could mention the best three sources here. Jeraxmoira🐉 (talk) 13:21, 28 March 2024 (UTC)
- "only have significant coverage surrounding her election as joint president": well, what's the matter with that? Coverage of her as one of the two leaders of an established political party. De Standaard, which we call a "quality newspaper", has a piece about her marriage, which also suggests a level of notability. PamD 16:34, 28 March 2024 (UTC)
- PamD: Thank you, that makes two sources. If you can share one more, I'll be happy to withdraw my nomination. Jeraxmoira🐉 (talk) 10:59, 31 March 2024 (UTC)
- I've added another source. PamD 11:34, 31 March 2024 (UTC)
- FWIW, bladi.net has an inbuilt forum, which I'm not sure any news media has. It doesn't look very reliable and the article does not have significant coverage, so I'm not withdrawing. I'll just leave it to the closing admin to make a decision. Cheers Jeraxmoira🐉 (talk) 11:52, 31 March 2024 (UTC)
- I've added another source. PamD 11:34, 31 March 2024 (UTC)
- PamD: Thank you, that makes two sources. If you can share one more, I'll be happy to withdraw my nomination. Jeraxmoira🐉 (talk) 10:59, 31 March 2024 (UTC)
- "only have significant coverage surrounding her election as joint president": well, what's the matter with that? Coverage of her as one of the two leaders of an established political party. De Standaard, which we call a "quality newspaper", has a piece about her marriage, which also suggests a level of notability. PamD 16:34, 28 March 2024 (UTC)
- PamD: Would you mind taking a deeper look at the nl:Nadia Naji's sources again? From what I can see via google translate, they only have significant coverage surrounding her election as joint president. Apart from that, I do not see significant coverage on the other sources! Also, it would be helpful if you could mention the best three sources here. Jeraxmoira🐉 (talk) 13:21, 28 March 2024 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, The Herald (Benison) (talk) 03:09, 1 April 2024 (UTC)Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗plicit 03:59, 8 April 2024 (UTC)
- Keep: She's the co-president of a major Belgian political party. The person who put this article up for deletion seems to be completely ignorant on Belgian politics and should refrain from putting up articles for deletion in the future on Belgian topics.
Sources:
https://www.vrt.be/vrtnws/nl/2023/11/04/ontbijtgesprek-nadia-naji-groen-michael-van-droogenbroeck/
- Comment: Being the co-president of a major Belgian political party will obviously attract a lot of media attention, but all the sources you have shared are just interviews from routine coverage. Interviews are not independent. Notability is not inherited, so being the co-president of Groen (political party) carries no weight here. If she is as important as you claim, then there should be a lot of reliable and published third-party sources available. Jeraxmoira🐉 (talk) 17:18, 14 April 2024 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Final relist.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 06:47, 15 April 2024 (UTC)
Here's even more sources (all major Belgian media, reliable, third party) outside of the five sources I already offered:
- https://www.hln.be/binnenland/interview-nadia-naji-30-vlaams-blok-woog-op-mijn-jeugd-ik-kan-vbers-geen-hand-geven-zolang-zij-geen-respect-voor-mij-tonen~af213995/
- https://www.standaard.be/cnt/dmf20240414_96614061
- https://www.brusselstimes.com/221713/flemish-greens-set-to-revive-the-party-with-new-leadership
- https://www.dezondag.be/actua/nadia01102023/
- https://www.knack.be/nieuws/belgie/politiek/naji-van-den-brandt-en-van-der-straeten-trekken-groene-lijst-in-brussel/
- https://bx1.be/categories/news/nadia-naji-groen-sur-les-liens-avec-ecolo-entre-francophones-et-neerlandophones-on-peut-travailler-ensemble/
- https://www.gva.be/cnt/dmf20231202_93310380
- 178.51.7.219 (talk) 178.51.7.219 (talk) 14:02, 16 April 2024 (UTC)
- Comment: Instead of sharing what you find on Google or in local searches, I would request you to analyze it yourself.
- HLN - Interview
- standaard.be - Interview
- brusselstimes - No in-depth coverage about the subject
- dezondag.be - Interview
- knack.be - No in-depth coverage
- bx1.be - Interview with no in-depth coverage on the text below.
- gva.be - Interview
- Being a co-president of Groen does not make her notable. Since she hasn't been elected to any office positions yet, NPOL does not apply. The Belgian news media, like any other news media in the world, are supposed to interview her or get a quote each time she makes a public appearance and these fall under routine coverage. The sources you have shared and subject at its current state does not pass the basic criteria. And the article cannot be merged as it does not pass any of the additional criteria as well. It should either be deleted, redirected to Groen or draftified. Jeraxmoira🐉 (talk) 08:02, 21 April 2024 (UTC)
- Here's the basic criteria:
- "People are presumed notable if they have received significant coverage in multiple published secondary sources that are reliable, intellectually independent of each other, and independent of the subject."
- She clearly passes this, with your only objection being that a lot of coverage consists of interviews (instead of profile features?), but this is simply how Belgian media often times tends to work with regards to politicians.
- Furthermore [WP:BIO] clearly states:
- "If the depth of coverage in any given source is not substantial, then multiple independent sources may be combined to demonstrate notability; trivial coverage of a subject by secondary sources is not usually sufficient to establish notability."
- I'd argue a bit [WP:IAR] applies as well here. Belgian political party presidents occupy such an important part in the Belgian political system that party presidents gain automatic notability similar to that of elected politicians.
- The number of sources is only going to rapidly increase over the coming weeks and months, considering the upcoming elections and government formation. 178.51.7.219 (talk) 22:00, 21 April 2024 (UTC)
- IP, Jeraxmoira is saying she doesn't pass that, because these are interviews, and interviews are not independent of the subject. -- asilvering (talk) 05:58, 22 April 2024 (UTC)
- Adding on to what asilvering mentioned,
multiple independent sources
are required to pass WP:BIO, but we only have interviews here. You know she isn't notable when you are relying on WP:IAR as your last resort.Belgian political party presidents occupy such an important part in the Belgian political system that party presidents gain automatic notability similar to that of elected politicians.
- Notability is not inherited. You need to get a proposal passed in order to argue for automatic notability here.The number of sources is only going to rapidly increase over the coming weeks and months, considering the upcoming elections and government formation.
- Case of WP:NOTJUSTYET and WP:FUTURE.
- Jeraxmoira🐉 (talk) 10:59, 22 April 2024 (UTC)
- Comment: Instead of sharing what you find on Google or in local searches, I would request you to analyze it yourself.
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.